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Death, Pleasure, and what makes us Human

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Just so you can get my point of view: I am an American Citizen

 

Disclaimer: When I speak of "organization" I do not mean the islamic people. I am speaking of Al Qaeda. Muslims are not the enemy and they never were. If anything they are more of a victim to Al Qaeda than America was.

 

 

I'm very conflicted right now. I realize that Osama Bin Laden is a horrible person who has been the cause of thousands if not millions of deaths, but isn't he still human? Does anyone truly deserve death by the hand of another human? The world is a better place without him in it, that is not the conflict I am having within myself. The problem I am having is one that defines, I believe, whether I am human or not.

 

Why is it that so many people cheer at the loss of a human life? Yes that human was by all standards evil, but doesn't it bring us down to his level if we find pleasure in his death. His organization found pleasure in the death of American citizens on 9/11/2001, isn't that what we found so evil and despicable about them?

 

So the problem I present you is this: Does it make you more or less human if you don't feel pleasure from the death of a horrible person? So many other americans were cheering in the streets, is cheering and celebrating the correct(human) way to react? Is it even worse if I feel almost burdened by the fact that america has so much blood on it's hands, despite the fact that these humans are arguably "evil"?

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I'd say your "humanity" has little to do with how you react to such things, but I guess it depends on what you mean by that. If you mean purely psychologically I'd find it hard to argue that there is something wrong with either side of that line so to speak. Feeling happy when someone you consider a bad person dies is a pretty normal response I'd think as is experiencing a sense of waste at the loss of human life. As it happens I'm with you in that I'm not particularly happy with the outcome but I understand how some people are, neither response is more or less "human" than the other.

You could of course view it from a moral/philosophical perspective as well and ask the question if this is a just way to deal with such people but I guess that isn't what your post is about?

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Philosophically, I'm on the side of being glad that bin Laden is gone. I've had a couple people tell me that I'm a hypocrite for saying this; that I was against those that were purportedly glad that 9/11 happened. I don't buy this argument for one large reason:

 

Osama bin Laden is not the same as people living in New York and DC just going about their daily lives. Scientifically, OBL and the people in NYC and DC are the same species, sure, but, OBL's actions make him different from the NYC/DC residents.

 

As for the innocent deaths that America is responsible for (yes, there is the blood of many innocents on the hands of America), I believe that's a different subject entirely. Also, I'm not sure if we're actually "celebrated OBL's death" so much as celebrating a return to justice. OBL didn't go down without a fight; he didn't turn his back and put his hands behind his head and a bullet was put into his brain. OBL hid behind a human shield and engaged in a firefight (according to reports I've read).

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Just a clarification... Is this specifically about Osama-event related feelings, or the whole philosophical area of finding pleasure from killing?

Don't insult me. I have trained professionals to do that.

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If that question was directed to me, Osama only.

Directed at the OP... I should have clarified my clarification question's direction... lol

Don't insult me. I have trained professionals to do that.

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It might be wrong to feel that way. It is also entirely human and natural.

 

Now yes, some people took the cheering to dumb extremes. I myself didn't cheer, though I am pleased as punch that he's dead. This is mainly because I equate the cheerers with the people who, when their team wins a game, say "WE" won.

 

No, you did not win, if you did not participate. I would say you are in on this "we" if you ae a member of the armed services or anyone who has been actively working towards the capture or killing of BinLaden or his ilk.

 

Then you get to cheer just as the guys sitting behind the desks at Mission Control cheered when Apollo 11 landed. They were part of the effort.

 

So I won't cheer, or celebrate, or do anything more than call members of my family who are servicepeople, and maybe make a couple of donations to charities I support (for the karma, you understand.)

 

But I'm still glad the lousy piece of crap is dead. *And he smiled quietly to himself.* Ain't nothing wrong with that.

 

Stoop to his level? Not possible. Not even CLOSE.

He just kept talking and talking in one long incredibly unbroken sentence moving from topic to topic so that no one had a chance to interrupt it was really quite hypnotic...

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The waste of life is a fact of the world we live in, i wouldn't think twice for Osama. It doesn't matter to me, but for several thousand (If not more) it does, or at least i presume so.

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I would never cheer for someone's death, even if it was Osama.

same.

"When a son is born, the father will go up to the newborn baby, sword in hand; throwing it down, he says, "I shall not leave you with any property: You have only what you can provide with this weapon."

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"Osama Bin Laden is dead. Celebrate the justice, not the death."

I pretty much agree with that quote.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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It might be wrong to feel that way. It is also entirely human and natural.

Wise words. Very true.

 

Directed at the OP... I should have clarified my clarification question's direction... lol

Nothing like recursive humor

 

I would never cheer for someone's death

I hope you never do. However, odds and human nature (and also what I believe to be inevitable course of future events) are against you on this one.

I bring you mortal danger and cookies. Not necessarily in that order.

http://www.youtube.com/jclc

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I would never cheer for someone's death, even if it was Osama.

same.

Yes :/

"Even if something sounds logical, it doesn't mean it have to be true"

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Justice? The Al Quaida group is not dead. They'll just point out a new leader and keep doing what they do.

 

I don't mean to be killing the joy, but I just think instead of celebrating, we should be preparing for a new era of terrorism as I doubt this is the end of it.

Game developments at http://nukedprotons.blogspot.com

Check out my music at http://technomancer.bandcamp.com

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Indeed, this won't stop Al Quaida(it will only motivate them if anything)

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Osama's death is a +1 for America, but cheering somebody's death isn't exactly what somebody should be doing. Unfortunately, we're human too and if somebody that caused me a lot of problems was killed I wouldn't be able to help but maybe yell out in joy. I'd feel bad about it later if I knew them personally at one point but none of us know that man like so. It's nothing personal here so I don't see too much wrong with it.

 

[joke] The thing I thought when I heard about his death was, "The next Call of Duty is going to be awesome." And I'm not the only one. [/joke]

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Osama's death is a +1 for America, but cheering somebody's death isn't exactly what somebody should be doing. Unfortunately, we're human too and if somebody that caused me a lot of problems was killed I wouldn't be able to help but maybe yell out in joy. I'd feel bad about it later if I knew them personally at one point but none of us know that man like so. It's nothing personal here so I don't see too much wrong with it.

 

[joke] The thing I thought when I heard about his death was, "The next Call of Duty is going to be awesome." And I'm not the only one. [/joke]

The problem with your theory is that this isn't a game, there is no score, there is no +1 for America, or for al quaida. There are just people dying all over the place, and whether that be Americans or people from al quaida, it doesn't solve anything.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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The problem with your theory is that this isn't a game, there is no score, there is no +1 for America, or for al quaida. There are just people dying all over the place, and whether that be Americans or people from al quaida, it doesn't solve anything.

+rep for that...

 

I'd rather cheer with joy the day we can finally live in peace and not in fear of terrorism. Not that I believe that day is near at all.

Game developments at http://nukedprotons.blogspot.com

Check out my music at http://technomancer.bandcamp.com

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I'd rather cheer with joy the day we can finally live in peace and not in fear of terrorism. Not that I believe that day is near at all.

I honestly believe that day will never be seen by us or even our great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-grandchildren... Probly even be worse for them...

Don't insult me. I have trained professionals to do that.

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